Need your advice

[Gittje]

I have a mild to moderate hearing loss, due either to hereditary causes or perhaps as a result of a fall when I was 16 years old (mild concussion). Since then I got ringing in the ears.

With aging the loss worsened and I noticed I also developed a mild form of hyperacusis for some sounds. At 46 I went to a hearing center to get my hearing seriously tested with following results.
Hz L R
125 -25 / -10
250 - 35 / -25
500 - 40 / -40
1 K - 40 / -45
2 K - 50 / -50
4 K - 50 / -45
8 K - 5 / - 5

I got the advice to wear HA. I couldn't get used to them, certainly not with a custom mold, and found them quite expensive for the use I would make of them (just at home) as I wasn't able to use them at the office. I liked the Phonak Savia art with open fit the most as music came to live again, but I had trouble with feedback.

We are now seven years later. My loss is remaining stable, but I want to give HA another try. After the Phonak Exelia Art and Widex Clear440 I am trying out the Phonak Ambra MicroM for the moment.

As posted in another topic my audi is still finding his way with the Target program and the possibilities of the aids. Last Monday I asked him to restore the August 24 settings, as the three adjustments made later, just made things worse.
At home I soon came to the conclusion that the HA still doesn't perform the way they were programmed on the 24th of August, especially with (classical) music. Is this possible? I called my audi, but he doesn't believe me and told me that my hearing is unstable :eek:

I am getting really disappointed and need advice:
1 - Is their a specific way to adjust the Phonak Ambra MicroM to a previous session that perhaps the audi overlooked (cf. wiping out the previous program)?
2 - Are the latest Phonak Aids good for listening to music?
3 - With my audiogram do you recommend custom molds, open fit or .... ?
4 – Should the tinnitus lessen with the HA on?
5 – Is my hearing loss so bad that you can say “if you don't use, lose it”?

[Don]

It will take several months of wearing them all day, every day, to get the most benefit. Your brain has to adjust to the new sounds and to the way the hearing aid presents these sounds, and every hearing aid is a little different.

To me, it is more important to have an audiologist who is an expert in adjusting the aids, and one with whom you can commuicate and feel comfortable, than the specific hearing aid model.

Once you get the basic things adjusted like fit, feedback, overall volume level, understanding speech in noisy environments, and any accessories like TV transmitter or bluetooth phone device, you just have to live with it for a while to make sure that model will help. That's why it is important to have a long trial period.

You mentioned that the hearing loss started after a fall, or you suspect that? I would go to an ENT for a checkup.

Your hearing loss is 40 at 500 so that might knock you out of having an open fit but your overall loss is mild enough that you might get away with it anyway. I use the tulip style open fit domes. They help with feedback more than the true open domes (the wagon wheel domes). I don't have any occlusion with the tulips and they are very comfortable.

[ZCT]

I called my audi, but he doesn't believe me and told me that my hearing is unstable :eek:

A better suggestion would be poor quality hearing aids, or poor quality programming. Sure your hearing could be unstable, but that is really rare. I'd say the odds are a hundred times more likely that your hearing professional hasn't done a great job of helping you.


I am getting really disappointed and need advice:
1 - Is their a specific way to adjust the Phonak Ambra MicroM to a previous session that perhaps the audi overlooked (cf. wiping out the previous program)?
2 - Are the latest Phonak Aids good for listening to music?
3 - With my audiogram do you recommend custom molds, open fit or .... ?
4 – Should the tinnitus lessen with the HA on?
5 – Is my hearing loss so bad that you can say “if you don't use, lose it”?


1 - Dunno.
2 - Most hearing aids have a multi memory option, and ideally one of these memories should be used for music. Most hearing aids are designed with speech in mind, and that's a very different proposition to listening to music. So a dedicated music program is probably the ticket.
3 - Open fit all the way. Just so long as you have a quality aid that isn't going to give you feedback issues, I would not use custom molds in your case. At least not for the type of aids I fit. The only reason to fit a custom mold in your case is if the hearing aid in question has poor feedback cancellation, so you avoid that issue by stuffing up the ears.
4 - Tinnitus *often* gets reduced by wearing hearing aids, cutting listening fatigue, giving the patient something to distract them, taking the strain out of hearing. But it is not a guarantee. I've seen everything from no change at all to the tinnitus right up to the tinnitus all but vanishing while wearing aids. It's really a coin flip as to where on the scale you might end up.
5 - I absolutely recommend hearing aids for you. Any time you have multiple results below 25dB, you need help.

Imagine your hearing nerve (cochlea) is a big piano, and each key on that piano is wired up to a piece of your brain responsible for hearing each note. Some notes on your piano are not working, so the corresponding piece of brain is not being stimulated. Without this stimuli you run the risk of that piece of brain being shut down. Wearing hearing aids creates more stimulation across a wider range of your brain, keeping it occupied and doing something useful. This helps preserve your long term speech understanding.

Hearing aids are not a magic cure to hearing loss, but ignoring a hearing problem and not wearing aids tends to lead to more problems down the road.

[prodigyplace]

We are now seven years later. My loss is remaining stable, but I want to give HA another try. After the Phonak Exelia Art and Widex Clear440 I am trying out the Phonak Ambra MicroM for the moment.

As posted in another topic my audi is still finding his way with the Target program and the possibilities of the aids. Last Monday I asked him to restore the August 24 settings, as the three adjustments made later, just made things worse.

Sorry, I do not know the answers to your questions, but I would be very wary of a professional that is still "finding his way" with the Target software trying to program Spice chip aids like the Ambra. I tried the Solana (level down from the Ambra) and Cassia (next level down).

I had a professional who thought they know what to do and, I am convinced, they were unable to program them properly. Like you, each programming session appeared to make things worse. I eventually went to a different professional for a different brand. The original audiologist would only try Phonak.

[Gittje]

I eventually went to a different professional for a different brand.
Next week I have to decide if I am buying the Ambra's or not. But they don't sound good and the audi isn't prepared to make further adjustments, so I am running out of options.

This morning I went to a Dialogue Center, just around the corner, to gather information. The audiologist works with GN Resound, Siemens, Widex and Phonak. As I want a music program, she told me that I have to consider premium aids. I was glad to hear she certainly considers an open fit.

[Gittje]

It will take several months of wearing them all day, every day, to get the most benefit. Your brain has to adjust to the new sounds and to the way the hearing aid presents these sounds, and every hearing aid is a little different.
Being a high-sensitive person I am not sure if one day I will be capable of wearing HA all day.

To me, it is more important to have an audiologist who is an expert in adjusting the aids, and one with whom you can commuicate and feel comfortable, than the specific hearing aid model.
My current audi has proved that he isn't an expert with programming the Ambra's. I suggested that perhaps with could call in a Phonak rep but he says a rep won't be of any help for the fine tuning. Now I have come to a point that he doesn't want to make further adjustments although I told him that I wasn't happy with how the aids sounds.

Your hearing loss is 40 at 500 so that might knock you out of having an open fit but your overall loss is mild enough that you might get away with it anyway. I use the tulip style open fit domes. They help with feedback more than the true open domes (the wagon wheel domes). I don't have any occlusion with the tulips and they are very comfortable.
Thanks for the suggestion.

[Gittje]

I'd say the odds are a hundred times more likely that your hearing professional hasn't done a great job of helping you.
I have given him much credit, but now I am realising that perhaps I should try elsewhere.

Open fit all the way. Just so long as you have a quality aid that isn't going to give you feedback issues, I would not use custom molds in your case. At least not for the type of aids I fit. The only reason to fit a custom mold in your case is if the hearing aid in question has poor feedback cancellation, so you avoid that issue by stuffing up the ears.
I suppose that the Phonak Ambra do a great job with feedsback cancellation, so I don't understand why the audi didn't fit me with open fit.

[seb]

Gittje,
The only way you will benefit from HA is to wear them all day. If you don't you will always have problems. On the other hand you have to have an Audiologist that you can work with and knows how to properly adjust your HA so they work for you. Once you get that problem solved you have to force yourself to stick with wearing the HA so you can get used to them and overtime you will! Finally, dump the Audi you now have and go elsewhere. Good luck!

[prodigyplace]

I have given him much credit, but now I am realising that perhaps I should try elsewhere.


I suppose that the Phonak Ambra do a great job with feedsback cancellation, so I don't understand why the audi didn't fit me with open fit.

I thought the Phonak Ambra was usually used as an open fit aid with a thin tube. Otherwise, they could be used with a thick tube and custom molds.If the audiologist did not have mold specially made for you, you probably are using open fit aids. The tulip domes Don mentioned are just an alternate end, instead of the ones that look like wagon wheels.

[seb]

When I was looking at Phonak HA my Audi said that any Phonak HA could be fit with a hook and a custom mold. I don't know if this is true but that is what I was told.

[Gittje]

I thought the Phonak Ambra was usually used as an open fit aid with a thin tube. Otherwise, they could be used with a thick tube and custom molds.If the audiologist did not have mold specially made for you, you probably are using open fit aids. The tulip domes Don mentioned are just an alternate end, instead of the ones that look like wagon wheels.
He made a mold specially for me and connected them with a thin tube. So I have a feel of occlusion and what's left from my normal hearing is also taken over by the HA :(

[Gittje]

Good luck!
Thanks! I'll keep you posted...

[Gittje]

Well, I have more news. By chance I was able to get an appointment today.

The audi confirmed me that he isn't willing to make any further adjustments now as he is convinced that the aids are set properly and my hearing seems to be unstable. He mentioned that he has years of experience and that he doesn't want to get suggestions from what I might have read on the internet. He ended with the remark that trust is lost on both sides and that it is difficult to work that way.

So I returned the Phonak Ambra. Afterwards I went straight ahead to the audi I have seen on Monday and my first appointement is set on the 31th of October.

[Gittje]

Last week I had an appointment with my new audi and she runned a few extra tests, next to the audiogram my ent took. In 2 weeks time I already got accustomed to my rather silent world again :)

Anyway, this afternoon I was fitted with the Alera 9 with tulip domes.
The audi didn't give me any gain in the low frequencies in the automatic program, just in the mids to strenghten speech recognition.
In the music program gain was added to the lows, a bit too much to my taste, and I have problems with continuous background noise in silent passages and some noises (own steps) and voices (from my partner) seem to come out of a cavern.

[DocAudio]

In the music program gain was added to the lows, a bit too much to my taste, and I have problems with continuous background noise in silent passages and some noises (own steps) and voices (from my partner) seem to come out of a cavern.

Is the additional gain in the lows only in the Music program and that is the program you are having the issues w/SQ mentioned above or are the problems with some noises (steps/partner's voice) in the main program as well??? If it's only when in the Music program, I'd be inclined to leave it since in that program you are supposed to be listening to Music and not footsteps/voices (speech). Music programs are specially designed to reduce/eliminate most if not all noise reduction and give a more flat response. Speech and other noises can sound very different in a Music program...but Music should sound much better. If the issues you are having are in the main program..give it a bit of time to settle down and you might find that in a few days it's not as noticeable.

The first thing I tell patients is those noises like your footsteps and things are sounds you just aren't accustomed to hearing (I'm sure you've heard this all before). People with normal hearing hear all the same sounds but our brain filters it out. You can't do this yet because your brain isn't accustomed to it. The more you wear the hearing aids the better your brain gets at filtering those noises out.

The Alera 9's have worked well for the patients I have wearing them. The tulip dome may be contributing a little to the "cavey" sound. You could always try a more open dome and that may resolve the problem.

[eyesgreendeaf]

DocAudio, is your explanation of music program also valid about phonak naida aids? I have music program but it doesn't sound very different from auto program but of more quality for music or acoustic environments.

[DocAudio]

DocAudio, is your explanation of music program also valid about phonak naida aids? I have music program but it doesn't sound very different from auto program but of more quality for music or acoustic environments.

Yes, in general, the Music programs will have less noise reduction and usually the mics will be fixed in an omni-directional mode. Hearing aids are smart but sometimes they perceive music as noise since spectrally, they are shaped similarly. So sometimes the hearing aids will shift the aid into a noise mode and negatively impact the quality of the music. The higher end products with music programs built in are better at selecting the correct mode for amplification, but they will still, for the most part, shut off the directional mics and reduce noise reduction.

I actually went into the software to double-check and the Music program for the Naida does the following:

Set to Omni-Directional
Noiseblock off
Windblock off
Soundrelax to weak
Whistleblock off


It might not sound all that different, some people notice a big difference, some don't. I think the type of music will also effect the sound.

[eyesgreendeaf]

The difference is obvious when listening to the music. Much more quality . If I listen with the auto program noise reduction kicks in and destroy the joy. But I needed eight weeks my brain to get used to naidas. I now have begun to enjoy my hearing aids.

[DocAudio]

The difference is obvious when listening to the music. Much more quality . If I listen with the auto program noise reduction kicks in and destroy the joy. But I needed eight weeks my brain to get used to naidas. I now have begun to enjoy my hearing aids.

Wonderful!:D

[Burke]

Programming, Programming, Programming....If the HA don't fit, you must quit!!!
If your hearing is worth it to you, find a professional who will take the time and sit a few hours if needed and get you hearing solid again. See if he has a TV or Stereo in his office, "hear" the programming before you leave the office.

I have a 22" flat screen and a nice MP3 powered stereo system in my office just so my patients can hear TV and Music with their new HA's..Why not show them what they will sound like? Or for perspective patients what they have been missing.

It's hard to trust a non hearing impaired Dispenser or Aud. Unless they have tried and used a pair of HA's and had them programmed to their loss (however minor it may be) they will never grasp what you go through and how just one wrong setting on your HA's can ruin everything.

When I got my HA's I adjusted, toyed, messed, experimented with every facet of programming for my HA's..So I KNOW what's going on with my patients HA's when they tell me "Loud and moderate sounds are not loud and sound mushy" I can lower the compression ratio a bit to clear it up for them. (Because I know from experience)

Good luck, just call around..there are good caring dispensers still out there..

[eyesgreendeaf]

Wonderful!:D


Thank you.

[Gittje]

The tulip dome may be contributing a little to the "cavey" sound. You could always try a more open dome and that may resolve the problem.
The audi did try with the normal wheel domes first, ran the feedback program and told me I could encounter problems with feedback. So she switched to tulip domes.

With the Phonak Ambra I didn't have such a hugh difference between the main program and the music program, except the 2nd one felt much more open and gave more detail. I had no problems with environment sounds whatsoever and all sounds still felt normal.

Not so with the Alera 9. But that's a first impression. In the coming days I hope to get used to it. A new appointment is scheduled on Monday.

Which BTE aids from Phonak, Resound and Siemens without receiver in the ear would you recommend with my loss:
Hz L R
125 -25 / -10
250 - 35 / -25
500 - 40 / -40
1 K - 40 / -45
2 K - 50 / -50
4 K - 50 / -45
8 K - 5 / - 5

[Gittje]

Programming, Programming, Programming....If the HA don't fit, you must quit!!! If your hearing is worth it to you, find a professional who will take the time and sit a few hours if needed and get you hearing solid again. See if he has a TV or Stereo in his office, "hear" the programming before you leave the office.
It was my first fit with my new audi, so I do not expect miracles :D Moreover, she told me my brain should get used to the new sounds.

And no, there is no possibility of listening to music or watch TV in her office and a appointment is rounded up within the hour. It was the same with my previous audi.

It's hard to trust a non hearing impaired Dispenser or Aud. Unless they have tried and used a pair of HA's and had them programmed to their loss (however minor it may be) they will never grasp what you go through and how just one wrong setting on your HA's can ruin everything.
I couldn't agree more. It's sometimes frustrating to try to explain what I hear and feel to audiologists. Some of them refer regularly on "their experience" and "my impairement", so it gives me the feeling that at a certain point they decide whether the HA's sound as they should :confused:

Good luck, just call around..there are good caring dispensers still out there..
Thanks to all of you. I am really grateful to get help and advice on this forum.

[DocAudio]

The audi did try with the normal wheel domes first, ran the feedback program and told me I could encounter problems with feedback. So she switched to tulip domes.

With the Phonak Ambra I didn't have such a hugh difference between the main program and the music program, except the 2nd one felt much more open and gave more detail. I had no problems with environment sounds whatsoever and all sounds still felt normal.

Not so with the Alera 9. But that's a first impression. In the coming days I hope to get used to it. A new appointment is scheduled on Monday.

Which BTE aids from Phonak, Resound and Siemens without receiver in the ear would you recommend with my loss:
Hz L R
125 -25 / -10
250 - 35 / -25
500 - 40 / -40
1 K - 40 / -45
2 K - 50 / -50
4 K - 50 / -45
8 K - 5 / - 5

Refresh my memory why a Receiver-in-the-ear isn't an option?

From experience, I have found that a standard BTE coupled to a thin tube never sounds as good as one coupled to an earhook and regular earmold. There is a noticeable change in sound quality between the two. The time I have tried to do a thin-tube fitting on a standard BTE I've always ended up switching over to the earhook/earmold combo and had far superior results. Perhaps think about giving that a try...you wouldn't think that a change in a tube and earmold would make that much of a difference, but it really can. When you decrease the interior diameter of BTE tubing (like a slim-tube does), it increases the high-frequency gain. Now the software supposedly takes this into account as long as the professional makes sure it knows that there is a slim-tube being used instead of an earhook/standard tube and makes appropriate changes but I still think it never sounds as good as the earhook/standard tube combo. And if the professional forgets to change the acoustic parameters in the software, well then everything they think they are doing is wrong. This is when Real-ear comes in handy.

Interestingly enough, for my patients who don't like the way the Ambra or Smart IX sound, I switch to the Alera 9...lol.

With a loss like yours, an open fit may allow too much low frequency gain to escape and therefore not give you the amount of volume you need with your loss. If you are only hearing the mid and high frequency sounds, everything will sound...off/wierd. Maybe a little like Minnie-mouse since there are no lows to balance out the mids and highs. If you had normal hearing in those lower frequencies then that would be fine, but with a mild/moderate loss @125-1000Hz you need some low-frequency amplification. I'm not saying that an open-fit isn't possible, but it probably won't sound as good as a fit made with an earmold and more standard venting.

I am still a huge fan of the Ambra...but not the MicroM. I figure if a patient is paying that much money they should get every feature available and the microM doesn't have a Volume Control on it. The microP does and is only slightly longer.

So if you walked into my office and said that a RIC is not an option, then I'd look at a standard BTE with an earmold (hook and no slim-tube), preferably the Ambra but if that didn't work then the next choice would be the Alera 9.

There is another hearing aid, the Unitron Quantum20 (if you don't want a RIC which is the Moxy20) that has a music program where you tell the hearing aid the kind of music you are listening to and it shapes the response based on that. I know it's not a hearing aid company your current pro has but it is something to consider. There are some other cool features on the aid to help with overall sound quality and clarity as well...

What specific issues are you having with the sound of the hearing aids? That might help as well....

[Gittje]

Refresh my memory why a Receiver-in-the-ear isn't an option?
I don't say they are no option. It's just the first time I was fit with RIC's and I don't know much about the technology. What are the benefits of RIC's and what the drawbacks? How do receiver in the ear and wax manage in the long run?

What specific issues are you having with the sound of the hearing aids?
As the Alera 9 are programmed now in the standard program I sometimes feel like I am under a glass bell. On the other hand this means that I am capable of wearing them all day as sounds never get uncomfortable, something I couldn't do with the Ambra's. In the Music program I have continous background noise that interfers with silent passages and I have to get used to the gain of the lows too.

Perhaps I am making the mistake to compare the Alera 9 to the Phonak Ambra that sounded more crisp and clear. But I am only at my 2nd day with the Alera. I have to give my brain time to get accustomed to them.

[DocAudio]

I don't say they are no option. It's just the first time I was fit with RIC's and I don't know much about the technology. What are the benefits of RIC's and what the drawbacks? How do receiver in the ear and wax manage in the long run?

The main advantage is that they are smaller and more lightweight often feeling like nothing is there at all. The other main advantage is that they are designed to be more open. They do sound a little different from the BTE with the slim tube, even though the circuitry is essentially the same. I find patients prefer the sound of the RIC over the BTE sometimes...I like them because if there is a malfunction in the receiver (which in addition to the mics are the parts that break the most often) you can switch it out in the office and the patient is on their way. While BTE's rarely have issues with receivers, ITE's can be prone to problems since the receiver is down in the canal and exposed to the wax/moisture more. Being able to repair it in the office means no down-time for these types of repairs. Drawbacks is there are fewer controls on them (button can either be VC or memory button for phonak aids) and they go through batteries faster since they are smaller than the microP (312 vs. 13). They can be a little trickier to insert as well...

As the Alera 9 are programmed now in the standard program I sometimes feel like I am under a glass bell. On the other hand this means that I am capable of wearing them all day as sounds never get uncomfortable, something I couldn't do with the Ambra's. In the Music program I have continous background noise that interfers with silent passages and I have to get used to the gain of the lows too.

Perhaps I am making the mistake to compare the Alera 9 to the Phonak Ambra that sounded more crisp and clear. But I am only at my 2nd day with the Alera. I have to give my brain time to get accustomed to them.

It's important that you are able to wear them all day. My guess on why the Music program sounds like that is you are getting low frequency gain you are supposed to have which is picking up more environmental noise. Is the silent passages you mention for speech? Where exactly are you using the Music program? I would say that if it sounds good for Music, then it is doing its job.

I don't think it's a mistake to compare the two. Ultimately you have to decide which you prefer...while crisp/clear is ideal if you couldn't wear them all day then that doesn't matter too much then. I agree that adjustment is the key, you might find in a few days that the Alera's sound just as good.

[Gittje]

They can be a little trickier to insert as well...
I discovered that already :D

Is the silent passages you mention for speech? Where exactly are you using the Music program?
No, not for speech but for silent passages in (classical) music. I use the music program at home where there is almost no background disturbance. When I put the Alera's on music program I experience more noise that seems to be generated from the aids themselves then with all the BTE HA I have tested with the previous audi.

I agree that adjustment is the key, you might find in a few days that the Alera's sound just as good.
For the moment I prefer the sound of the Phonak Ambra MicroM being more crisp and clear. I was able to listen to the flatscreen TV without any problem with them, not so with the Alera 9 where I have to redirect sound through the HiFi to help me to understand speech clearly.

BTW, the reason why music and TV is so important for testing the HA is because up till now I haven't been able to use the aids at work due to very bad acoustics, noisy environment (7 phones and 7 colleagues people chit chatting continuously) in a limited, open space.

As you explained in a previous post, I might propose my audi to try out a BTE with a custom mold and tube as apparantly this benefits the sound. I bet she will be surprised.

[Don]

BTW, the reason why music and TV is so important for testing the HA is because up till now I haven't been able to use the aids at work due to very bad acoustics, noisy environment (7 phones and 7 colleagues people chit chatting continuously) in a limited, open space.

As you explained in a previous post, I might propose my audi to try out a BTE with a custom mold and tube as apparantly this benefits the sound. I bet she will be surprised.

I disagree that listening to TV is the same as live speech with background noise. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other.

I don't think the Alera is creating sound. It may be picking up background noise like air movement, hum of equipment, etc. You can ask your pro to turn down background sounds. It may take several adjustments to get everything just right.

[Gittje]

I disagree that listening to TV is the same as live speech with background noise. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other.
May be, but I didn't need extra help (redirecting sound through HiFi) with the Ambra's and that since day one. Being on holiday, I am not able to try out the aids in office environment.

I don't think the Alera is creating sound. It may be picking up background noise like air movement, hum of equipment, etc. You can ask your pro to turn down background sounds. It may take several adjustments to get everything just right.
The audi told me that in the music program it's just the intention not to turn down noises. I suppose that aids do not make the difference between "noice" and "music".

Now I am listening to a CD with nature sounds (running water, birds etc.) and I have to put my headphone on to enjoy the different sounds. Without the headphones I even hear the breathing of my dog next to me and I can barely notice the running water.

[Don]

Now I am listening to a CD with nature sounds (running water, birds etc.) and I have to put my headphone on to enjoy the different sounds. Without the headphones I even hear the breathing of my dog next to me and I can barely notice the running water.

So the aids are so good that to focus on just the music you wear headphones to block out your dog breathing? This is a good thing. Sounds like they are working well.

How are things on the general program? That is what you will use 99% of the time.

[Gittje]

How are things on the general program?
The sounds are not really clear, rather dull I should say, although the audi didn't add gain in het lows to be sure to emprove speech understanding.

They aids are programmed in that way that sounds won't overwhelm me, but if regularly gives me the feeling of living under a glass bell.

I am looking forward to my next appointment with the audi on Monday.

[eyesgreendeaf]

Did your audi do rem test ?

[Gittje]

Did your audi do rem test ?
Is this the moment where you have to keep still and a special noise runs through the aids? If so, the answer is yes.

It's the first time that I know of HA being programmed by the audi in the office beforehand and not within the ear. My previous audi always programmed the aids within the ear.

[alpine1]

Is this the moment where you have to keep still and a special noise runs through the aids?

Your speaking about a feedback test, not REM.

[prodigyplace]

They are talking about the Real Ear Measurement test.

[Gittje]

Your speaking about a feedback test, not REM.
Well, in that case I must answer that my audi didn't do a REM test.

Addendum
This morning my audi adapted the aids and they sound a lot better:-)