People who speak softly P*$$ ME OFF!

[BradMM]

This is a new phenomenon but I'm currently teaching a small class with only four people in a small hotel meeting room. I don't experience this normally but these people all seem to just speak softly and I'm constantly saying "HUH???" Because I don't normally experience this, I think they are responsible for the gap in communication when they've repeatedly heard me says "WHAT?" and they don't speak up. I took my wife to the doctor recently and in that little exam room the MD seemed so meek and timid that he couldn't speak to where his patient could hear him. That's unprofessional IMHO and I think people should be aware of whether they are communicating effectively or not.

(steps down from soapbox)

[DocAudio]

This is a new phenomenon but I'm currently teaching a small class with only four people in a small hotel meeting room. I don't experience this normally but these people all seem to just speak softly and I'm constantly saying "HUH???" Because I don't normally experience this, I think they are responsible for the gap in communication when they've repeatedly heard me says "WHAT?" and they don't speak up. I took my wife to the doctor recently and in that little exam room the MD seemed so meek and timid that he couldn't speak to where his patient could hear him. That's unprofessional IMHO and I think people should be aware of whether they are communicating effectively or not.

(steps down from soapbox)

While people who speak softly can definitely be frustrating...are you wearing hearing aids??? You have a moderate hearing loss which would definitely make it seem as if people who are speaking in a perfectly normal volume voice are speaking more softly then they truly are. If you are wearing hearing aids, perhaps they need to be adjusted somewhat...I have seen a lot of patients walking around on 80 and 90% of target settings complaining that people are not talking loud enough simply because their hearing aids are set too low.

Just something to think about.

[BradMM]

The reason that I'm on this forum is because I know I have hearing loss. I tried CIC's and am now waiting on BTE's so I'm not currently wearing HA's. However, my point is that, even if my hearing is not perfect, why bother talking if you're not going to make the effort to communicate with the other person. I'm not the only person with a problem in that scenario. If you keep doing the same thing over and over and expect a different result then I've got a bridge in Arizona I want to sell you! If I say "huh?" or "what" several times to the same student, shouldn't they clue in to the fact that our communication is not working and they need to stand closer, look at me when they talk, enunciate, speak louder.... do SOMETHING different???

The MD I mentioned raised his voice for about 15 seconds and then reverted to his normal voice again. My wife, who has no hearing loss I know of, couldn't hear him either. I guess people just tend to stick with what they are normally accustomed to until they have a motivating enough reason to change it.

[seb]

Brad,
You need to tell your students you have a hearing loss and they need to speak up so you can hear them. You could also tell them your HA are in for repair and without them you are having trouble hearing them and they need to speak louder. Nothing is worse than a soft talker! Good luck!

[Hask12]

Get your hearing aids and then complain. While I can sympathize with your frustration you need to meet people half way and so far you haven't done that. Most people don't care about your hearing problem, nor do they understand it. It's YOUR problem, not theirs. Went to motor vehicle a couple of years ago and the woman refused to speak up. My wife was there and she was trying to help me but this woman had the nerve to tell my wife that she was interfering. The woman standing next to her, behind the counter, even said you have to speak up dear he's hard of hearing. All to no avail. I think there should be a law that once you explain your situation and you are ignored you should be allowed to climb over the counter and strangle the person.:eek: Get your hearing aids. Then you can complain all you want, although it probably won't matter.

[BradMM]

Brad,
You need to tell your students you have a hearing loss and they need to speak up so you can hear them. You could also tell them your HA are in for repair and without them you are having trouble hearing them and they need to speak louder. Nothing is worse than a soft talker! Good luck!

I DID tell them that right from the beginning! I know to do that from past experience.

I told the MD the same thing but they all seem to revert to their comfort zone in short order. This causes me to have another thought... if my employer is obligated to accommodate my disability, should they provide my HA's?? :D

I'm just blowing off steam, pay no attention! :p

[DocAudio]

I DID tell them that right from the beginning! I know to do that from past experience.

I told the MD the same thing but they all seem to revert to their comfort zone in short order. This causes me to have another thought... if my employer is obligated to accommodate my disability, should they provide my HA's?? :D

I'm just blowing off steam, pay no attention! :p

Many states have offices of vocational rehabilitation that do provide hearing aids to those working/in search of work...I see probably 2-5 a month who get hearing aids I would normally sell at $4600/pair for nothing.

[Gittje]

Get your hearing aids. Then you can complain all you want, although it probably won't matter.
Precisely. Moreover, many people are convinced that hearing aids eliminates all hearing problems.

I tried to explain my problems to my colleagues at the office. I can't complain, they listened patiently, but that's about all :D

[mickeydblv]

I think it's a perception issue for those people who can't seem to speak up. I think they are the same as the folk who would talk very loudly when they have an MP3 player playing at volume.

If you were being shown a map or newspaper from a distance and you said you can't see it, they would bring it closer to you so you can see the details. When it comes to hearing though...?

There are those who appear to see themselves as calm & serene and raising a voice is neither of those attributes so they wont do it. A very powerful identity issue there - and "don't raise your voice!" can be a strong rule when growing up.

I guess many and varied are the reasons why some people wont talk with a little move vigour. They are the ones that I feel like vaulting the counter and strangling.

[Um bongo]

I think it's a perception issue for those people who can't seem to speak up. I think they are the same as the folk who would talk very loudly when they have an MP3 player playing at volume.

If you were being shown a map or newspaper from a distance and you said you can't see it, they would bring it closer to you so you can see the details. When it comes to hearing though...?

There are those who appear to see themselves as calm & serene and raising a voice is neither of those attributes so they wont do it. A very powerful identity issue there - and "don't raise your voice!" can be a strong rule when growing up.

I guess many and varied are the reasons why some people wont talk with a little move vigour. They are the ones that I feel like vaulting the counter and strangling.

I appreciate that there are difficulties with different voices, but blaming people for being indistinct is pretty much as close to denial as you can get. You are moving the locus of the 'fault' away from your hearing loss to other people. Is it also their fault if they talk with an accent or a speech-trait that you find difficult to understand. However, if they work in customer services, it's likely that they will have developed a level and delivery that works for 'most' people, without appearing to be too passive or aggressive.

Part of the rehabilitation of dealing with a loss is overcoming and acknowledging the effect the loss on your everyday life. Once you have moved through the denial and outrage you'll be able to be positive about dealing with your loss. Taking it out on everybody else isn't the answer: unfortunately.

Either that or you have to find the someone with a decent Baritone voice and good annunciation wherever you go ;)

[lohearn]

Soft voices are so hard to understand. One of my very dear friends speaks very softly. We recently went out to dinner and I needed her to repeat herself many, many times. And I know for a fact she was "speaking up" for my benefit, but in a restaurant setting her "loud" voice was still way too soft for me.

At home, I live with a mumbler. My son mumbles, he also has a hearing loss. Not sure if his own hearing loss plays a part in why he mumbles, but he mumbles. Drives me crazy. The other day I got the teen "I guess NOT" thing from him when we were in the kitchen. Apparently he had asked me to hand him something and I never heard him, damn mumbler.

I think it goes back to our disability being an invisiable disability. If they can't see it, it simply doesn't exist. Doesn't matter what you *say* to them about it, if they can''t see it then it's not an issue for them. The only people I've encountered who will always speak louder when I ask them to is waitresses and waiters, maybe we need to pay people to talk louder? ;)

[BradMM]

I appreciate that there are difficulties with different voices, but blaming people for being indistinct is pretty much as close to denial as you can get. You are moving the locus of the 'fault' away from your hearing loss to other people.

I respectfully disagree. I've heard this "denial" angle before but I have experienced neither denial or outrage... it is what it is. The only thing that delayed me seeking HA's was that I'm CHEAP and I wanted to "get by" as long as possible just to avoid the cost (which I can easily afford, that's not it). Plus, some people I work with tell me "you don't need HA's" so that was part of my feedback. In the end, I see the handwriting on the wall but denial or outrage was not a barrier.

The reality is that SOME people DO talk softly and seem to be unaware or unconcerned if they are not communicating adequately. Communication is a two way street. If I express my inability to hear them, I have shown that I'm trying to bridge the gap. If they continue to talk in their mousy voice, that has nothing to do with me being in denial. They are responsible for the gap in communication.

This morning, I was in a room with about 25 people all sitting around a big table. I could hear everyone just fine (no HA's) because they all spoke "normally" as measured by the normal volume of most people. Yesterday, I was in a smaller room with fewer people and I couldn't hear what most of them said because they were either very soft-voiced or would talk to me with their head down looking at the material in front of them. I don't know how acoustics may have come into play but the rooms seemed to be of similar construction.

In the end, I'm sure that all these situations exist and there is no single problem or answer but I don't think it's appropriate to stereotype everyone with hearing loss (especially me! ;)) as being in denial about it if they believe that others could meet them half way and speak up, face you when they speak, at least be in the same room, enunciate, etc. That's simply not true!

[Um bongo]

I disagree. I've heard this "denial" angle before but the reality is that SOME people DO talk softly and seem to be unaware or unconcerned if they are not communicating adequately. Communication is a two way street. If I express my inability to hear them, I have shown that I'm trying to bridge the gap. If they continue to talk in their mousy voice, that has nothing to do with me being in denial. They are responsible for the gap in communication.

This morning, I was in a room with about 25 people this morning all sitting around a big table. I could hear everyone just fine (no HA's) because they all spoke "normally" as measured by the normal volume of most people. Yesterday, I was in a smaller room with fewer people and I couldn't hear what most of them said because they were either very soft-voiced or would talk to me with their head down looking at the material in front of them. I don't know how acoustics may have come into play but the rooms seemed to be of similar construction.

In the end, I'm sure that all these situations exist and there is no single problem or answer but I don't think it's appropriate to stereotype everyone with hearing loss (especially me! ;)) as being in denial about it if they believe that others could meet them half way and speak up, face you when they speak, at least be in the same room, enunciate, etc. That's simply not true!

In terms of Normal: you might want to look up something called the 'Lombard Effect'

It wasn't a stereotype. It is an observable rehabilitation step, some people transition these very quickly, some people need longer.

I have one further question about these situations, would they have provided any hearing issues for you when you were, say, 16-25 years old?

[seb]

What I've found with soft talkers is they usually have excellent and I mean excellent hearing. A close friend of mine is one of the softest speakers I know, when he was taking his physical for the draft during the Vietnam era, his hearing was so good an officer told him "with his hearing he wanted him at the point because he could hear the enemy first ,needless to say he got a deferment by going to college. I have several other friends that speak softer than the average person and all have excellent hearing. I've also found it 's almost impossible to get them to speak louder for any length of time because they gradually drift back to their soft speaking voice. I don't have a meter but I would be willing to bet they speak 10-20 db softer than everyone else. Just my 2 cents.

[Hask12]

People telling you that you don't need aids is just an excuse. You're the one with the hearing problem, you're test results clearly show that. It's just a tad self centered to now expect everyone to adjust to your situation because you're too cheap to do anything about it yourself. A lot of people out there need aids but can't afford them. Your attitude is beginning to tick me off.:mad:

[mickeydblv]

Interesting thread...

I understand what you're saying Um bongo, and there can be some folk who are going to be in denial about hearing loss - but I would not expect this forum to be a place where there are many folk in denial. Resistant, reluctant, frustrated some are for sure - and that's just me!

If I could make a comparison: If you are in a bar and having a drink with no ice in it (and you like ice) and you ask the bar-person for some ice in the next round but it doesn't arrive... you might think they mis-heared, don't give a monkey's or some another explanation. For me, it's similar to that.

It's a simple request: Please speak up. They don't. They can be very helpful with other requests but increasing the dB on their voice does not seem to be possible. I work with someone like that, and notably, as seb said, they have excellent hearing (thanks for the 2 cents.)

The 'Lombard Effect' presented by Um bongo is so relevant. Some folk don't seem to have an external reference so when listening to an mp3 player they will talk loudly to make themselves more audible to themselves. The ability to second or third position themselves to other's auditory perspective seems to be a very challenging activity.

I'm getting used to it and it's like going out in the car and getting cut up by someone - why get upset? As if it doesn't happen every time you go out in the car! Every time!

So for my hearing, going to work or out and about, some people are not given to appreciating the difficulties I'm having and are not helpful, even when I specifically request it. Shame. Frustrating, yes. Getting used to it, yes. [Still given to thumping them sometimes ;) ]

[alpine1]

People telling you that you don't need aids is just an excuse. You're the one with the hearing problem, you're test results clearly show that. It's just a tad self centered to now expect everyone to adjust to your situation because you're too cheap to do anything about it yourself. A lot of people out there need aids but can't afford them. Your attitude is beginning to tick me off.:mad:

Have to agree with Hask on this one...to blame others for not speaking up is not right.

[BradMM]

I have one further question about these situations, would they have provided any hearing issues for you when you were, say, 16-25 years old?

When I was 16 - 25 and I was conversing with someone who wasn't hearing me, I would have made the effort to help them out in some way such as speaking more loudly. To me, it's called common courtesy. I don't understand this insistence on TOTAL RESPONSIBILITY in effective communication being with the person who has hearing loss.

[BradMM]

People telling you that you don't need aids is just an excuse. You're the one with the hearing problem, you're test results clearly show that. It's just a tad self centered to now expect everyone to adjust to your situation because you're too cheap to do anything about it yourself. A lot of people out there need aids but can't afford them. Your attitude is beginning to tick me off.:mad:

Hask,

If I'm walking down the street and a blind person with a cane is coming toward me, I guess I'm not supposed to make any effort to accommodate successful negotiation of us crossing paths. THEY are the one who can't see, why should I go out of my way to make the transition better. That would be consistent with your position regarding my frustration with people who won't try to communicate more effectively which has been my point all along.

[BradMM]

People telling you that you don't need aids is just an excuse.

Whose excuse? They don't need an excuse for expressing their opinion so that leaves only me which indicates you think I'm making an excuse. My CIC's are being returned and I'm waiting on new BTE's so where is the excuse??? Please explain!

[BradMM]

I'm just blowing off steam, pay no attention! :p

I guess some of you didn't get the memo.

[Um bongo]

When I was 16 - 25 and I was conversing with someone who wasn't hearing me, I would have made the effort to help them out in some way such as speaking more loudly. To me, it's called common courtesy. I don't understand this insistence on TOTAL RESPONSIBILITY in effective communication being with the person who has hearing loss.

That wasn't the point of the question.

The reason I asked it is whether you acknowledge that your ability to discern speech has deteriorated since then, and therefore whether you have fully come to terms with your loss. Before you assume I'm taking the proverbial, you might be interested in the (empirically established) 7-10years people 'put-up-with' a hearing loss before acting upon and seeking remediation via hearing aids.

I'm also genuinely (professionally) interested in the Psychology of an individual who clearly has the ability to orchestrate a pretty astute defence of why he 'ought' to be able to hear rather than seeking an obvious immediate and effective solution. This has a bearing on how I'd approach a prospective customer in the future: so the million dollar question is -

What would be needed to move you from being a frustrated non-hearing aid wearer to a motivated hearing aid wearer?

[Hask12]

A blind man with a cane, walking down the street, is making every effort to deal with his handicap, and i would be only too happy to help him if he needs it. As I have in the past. This person is making no effort what so ever to deal with his hearing loss but instead expects everyone to go out of their way for him. I'm the first to admit that there are a lot of rude inconsiderate people out there when dealing with the hearing impaired. I deal with it all the time. I was even sympathetic relating a personal experience I had myself with someone as Jerry Seinfeld referred to as a soft talker. But it's a two way street. If you're not going to try to improve your hearing because you are too "cheap" then don't complain about others not making an effort either. It's a two way street. Most of us on this forum do make an effort and then have every reason to complain. The blind guy with the cane walking down the street is trying to deal with his handicap, he's not expecting everyone to serve him. Get the aids and then you're more then welcome to vent.

[DocAudio]

Well, In his defense he is in the process of getting hearing aids...so we can't really criticize him for not doing anything when, in fact, he is doing something.

Here's my thoughts...some people mumble. Some people speak softly, some people speak clearly and concisely all the time (funny, no one ever has a problem hearing me...lol). When someone complains about everyone not speaking loud enough, well that's a sign of a larger problem. The people that speak softly and mumble, probably won't be able to ever get them to change their ways because it's in their nature to speak in that way. The best solution is to do what you can by getting hearing aids and making the most of what you have/controlling what you can control.

[seb]

To defend Brad, he said he doesn't run into it all the time, but his CURRENT class of 4 students speak softly and he is always asking HUH, so it's not everybody that is speaking softly, but these 4 students. I think we have all had to deal with soft speakers and even with HA we have problems ,so cut him some slack.

[Maureen]

I find it interesting that my HoH son who is 14 is VERY soft spoken! I think it is probably because he has always (since 16 months old) worn a full unvented earmold so he probably has considerable occlusion. I would imagine his own voice is quite loud to him so he speaks softly to compensate. It makes it difficult for me if there is any noise around. So much so that I had my hearing professionally tested along side him a year or two back. So far my hearing is still considered normal but I do have difficulty in loud environments.

Maureen

[prodigyplace]

I find it interesting that my HoH son who is 14 is VERY soft spoken! I think it is probably because he has always (since 16 months old) worn a full unvented earmold so he probably has considerable occlusion. I would imagine his own voice is quite loud to him so he speaks softly to compensate. It makes it difficult for me if there is any noise around. So much so that I had my hearing professionally tested along side him a year or two back. So far my hearing is still considered normal but I do have difficulty in loud environments.

Maureen
Your son's hearing professonal may be able to adjust the aids so hos voice sounds more normal to him. The problem will be that he likely does not know what "normal" sounds like.

Perhaps his professional can adjust the aids so your son's voice sounds not as loud, but other sounds are the same. This may encourage your son to speak up more.

[Reidan]

In many situations I can still hear most people just fine without my HA's, women and children more so than men since my loss is worse in the lower frequencies. But those few mumblers (of which my son is one) are the ones who made me finally get the HA's. I was never shy about telling people I had a hearing loss, and repeatedly reminding them. But it gets old after awhile.

My HA's have the remote for program and volume control. So I can adjust the volume to fit my amplification need at any given moment. But what I am finding now is that if I adjust the volume for the mumbler, the normal talkers, or heaven forbid those who's normal voice is almost a shout, they blow my ears off!!

So, my experience is that hearing aids will not fully resolve the issue of dealing with mumblers.

[poncho62]

Seems I am not thye only person with this problem....One of the main reasons I got HAs, was that I went back to work partb time and there were a couple of people that I couldnt hear...and I needed to in order to do the job...Got my aids and guess what?...I still have trouble hearing those same people....its better, but still have the occasional problem....I know the problem is mine, not theirs.....

BTW, other people also have trouble hearing those people too......but, I figure thats just the way they talk. When I go to speak with them, I crank my aids up to max.....

[seb]

Poncho,
Get your Audi to up the MF and HF a couple of db, it might help. My Audi upped mine just 2 db and it's made a huge improvement in soft speakers.

[Lalo]

Seems I am not thye only person with this problem....One of the main reasons I got HAs, was that I went back to work partb time and there were a couple of people that I couldnt hear...and I needed to in order to do the job...Got my aids and guess what?...I still have trouble hearing those same people....its better, but still have the occasional problem....I know the problem is mine, not theirs.....

BTW, other people also have trouble hearing those people too......but, I figure thats just the way they talk. When I go to speak with them, I crank my aids up to max.....

Whoa, whoa. Not speaking clearly and articulating poorly is their problem. Traditionally in most societies speaking clearly is part of being courteous. Unfortunately, manners have been slipping and this slippage in enunciation does not cause the talker any stress - it causes us stress. Yes, enunciating words and projecting speech are qualities that are to be admired and not everyone is excellent at these things. However, those who are so horrible at them and are not courteous don't deserve a pass.

In the workplace, this lack of courtesy has economic ramifications. You and I have disabilities. At least when at work here, the law requires that people accomodate us. Just like bird sounds at crosswalks and handicap ramps, better enunciation is not an unreasonable requirement and makes things function better.

[seb]

Lalo,
Unfortunately, I think the problem is ours and not theirs. Those with good hearing have a tendency to speak softer then we with hearing loss do and we tend to think they are mumbling or not speaking clearly. With HF hearing loss we don't need them to speak louder although it sometimes helps, but slower and clearer so we can make sense of what they are saying and this also helps with enunciation of words. This is hard to get across to someone who doesn't have a hearing problem, so it falls on us to train them and this isn't easy. Prior to HA, my wife who also wears HA, would speak to me loudly and very slowly as if she was talking to an idiot and this would just p--s me off; I would keep telling her " you don't have to speak louder just speak clearly and slower" but the next time I didn't hear her she would revert back to loud and slow, it wasn't until we both got HA that the problem was solved.

[Lalo]

"Those with good hearing have a tendency to speak softer then we with hearing loss do and we tend to think they are mumbling or not speaking clearly."

Nonsense. Most non hearing impaired people speak just fine and don't speak softly or mumble. Only about 1 in 50 people is a "soft talker" or mumbler. These people are discourteous. Not just to you and me but to anyone around them. ANYone can learn to enunciate and not mumble. Acting schools have speech classes that provide this training and it works. Now, mumblers may have other issues in life like low self esteem but that is their issue, not mine.

Fast talkers are another issue. I agree with you that for us, fast speech is more difficult to hear than low decibel speech. I do seem to be able to get some fast talkers to slow down. But the OP was not talking about fast talkers nor was I. We are talking about soft talkers and mumblers. You seem to be mixing up the two.

[seb]

Lalo,
I'm talking about people with extremely good hearing tend to be the soft talkers. That is from my personal experience.

[barkeater]

also a generational thing. Esp. female but boys can be just as bad. Walk through a middle school/high school hall some day and listen to how they speak. Articulating? not a priority. I try to approach it the same way as with other things that are out of my control. Try a little humor and have fun with it. I have found that now that I have begun wearing HAs that I don't have to ask folks to repeat themselves as much. but I have also tried to take ownership of my own hearing loss.

[Lalo]

Lalo,
I'm talking about people with extremely good hearing tend to be the soft talkers. That is from my personal experience.

Seb, You are saying that most - e.g. at least 51% - people are soft talkers? Huh? That would not make them soft talkers. That would put them in normal range. I am talking about people that speak softer than normal.

The last poster makes a good point. A lot of this is cultural and younger generations do not have the same view of courtesy and traditions and manners that older folks do. I do indeed have a tough time with HS kids, with my hearing aids on.

[seb]

Lalo,
No, What I'm saying is that of the people I know who talk softly all have had extremely good hearing and non of them have been mumblers. Most if not all of my friends commented on how much my voice level dropped after I got HA and some of them didn't know I had HA until I told them, and as we know one of the symptoms of hearing loss is that we tend to speak louder and complain that people either don't speak loud enough or they mumble or both. Yes, some people do speak softer than others but the problem isn't so much them as it is our ability to hear them!

[Lalo]

Lalo,
I'm talking about people with extremely good hearing tend to be the soft talkers. That is from my personal experience.

Lalo,
No, What I'm saying is that of the people I know who talk softly all have had extremely good hearing and non of them have been mumblers. Most if not all of my friends commented on how much my voice level dropped after I got HA and some of them didn't know I had HA until I told them, and as we know one of the symptoms of hearing loss is that we tend to speak louder and complain that people either don't speak loud enough or they mumble or both. Yes, some people do speak softer than others but the problem isn't so much them as it is our ability to hear them!

I am still not understanding your point. Previously, you contended that most people with normal hearing speak softly. That made no sense to me. If most people speak a certain way, then that is normal. The OP was not talking about normal voices, he was talking about people with exceptionally soft voices and mumblers.

Now, you seem to be asserting that the better one's hearing, the softer one speaks. This may be your anecdotal experience but I would venture to say that there is no statistical correlation between the two at all among those who have no hearing loss.

Some people speak softly and some don't due to all kinds of factors, such as genetics and upbringing. I mean it is nice you have a theory about some correlation but it would mean all those homeless guys yelling at me downtown and a bunch of people in Italy and China have pretty severe hearing losses.

Anyways, here is a link for all those soft talkers and mumblers.

http://www.wikihow.com/Stop-Mumbling-and-Speak-Clearly

[rashkolnikov]

I teach English to Japanese. Talk about shy, quiet and reserved!!! The classes of 8-10 year old girls are downright mousey. I used to grab the white board eraser and mime like it was a TV remote, turning up the volume. That gets a laugh and has the desired effect and you can easily do it again when the effect wears off without ever having to stop smiling or say another word. But that was when I could actually hear fairly well. Now I must accept that they are the customer and I do all that I can to minimize the negative effects of MY hearing loss and to make them comfortable, which usually means never asking them to say anything.:rolleyes:

[?tahW]

Seinfeld did a routine on "low talkers".

I've known two in my life, and this current one gets hung up on by answering machines. I can tell her a half dozen times that I can't hear her (in a quiet car) and she gets this sly smile and does not speak up. I find it infuriating.
She also blames the phones.

Personally, I think she is very angry and equates speaking up with expressing aggression.

And the message is, I will have to accommodate her and not the other way around. She also does other passive aggressive things.:(

[seb]

I've known enough low or soft talkers in my life that speak so softly that even people with good hearing can't understand what they are saying. Yes, and a few of them were unable to leave messages on answering machines because the machine "thought" no one was on the phone. The one thing I found to get them to speak up was to ignore them until they speak louder and this isn't easy to do since some of them seem to be incapable of speaking louder. So good luck on getting her to speak louder, it sounds like you might be swimming up hill with her.

[?tahW]

Here's an excerpt from a link that gives another angle to this symptom

"Communication apprehension (CA) is the fear or anxiety associated with either real or anticipated communication with another person or persons. "

and also fits into this woman's background.

I guess I have more reading to do on this.

[corey]

I DID tell them that right from the beginning! I know to do that from past experience.

I told the MD the same thing but they all seem to revert to their comfort zone in short order. This causes me to have another thought... if my employer is obligated to accommodate my disability, should they provide my HA's?? :D

I'm just blowing off steam, pay no attention! :p

You hit right on about the comfort zone. Quite frankly people are uncomfortable around people they view as significantly different.

I had a detailed post that was removed that went into this comfort and requiring people with defects to modify themselves to be so called "NORMAL"

You more than meet them half way by having the aids in the first place. There was no excuse for the others to not come half way when your aids were down.

I been wearing aids for 30 years and I am not comfortable wearing them especially in new situations because the stupid stigma "DEAF AND DUMB" or your inferior.

first year I wore aids before starting school, had no issues at all, wearing them, that changed, when other people were introduced to the equation when school started and on.

I have the same issue you do and I am actually am wearing my aids on "max" volume. And No they do not needed to be adjusted up.

It especially becomes a problem in larger groups. People will not speak up when addressing a group. Even normal people can't hear whats being said , how do they expect us to hear them then if normals can't?

If we could all learn to be nicer to one another, then maybe, people would be willing to speak up without fear of belittling or other nasties? in general?.

[corey]

I've known enough low or soft talkers in my life that speak so softly that even people with good hearing can't understand what they are saying. Yes, and a few of them were unable to leave messages on answering machines because the machine "thought" no one was on the phone. The one thing I found to get them to speak up was to ignore them until they speak louder and this isn't easy to do since some of them seem to be incapable of speaking louder. So good luck on getting her to speak louder, it sounds like you might be swimming up hill with her.


OMG that reminds me of the African American female police officer from the movie "Police Academy"

They would tell her to speak up, only to have her speak softer.

[corey]

Lalo,
I'm talking about people with extremely good hearing tend to be the soft talkers. That is from my personal experience.


Have a neighbor who has unusual hearing being extra sensitive he always telling me to talk quietly when around him he also talks lower as well.

Not sure it may be related to a non malignant tumors he has in his scull.

So he is a rare bird but aptly fits tour point about exceptional hearing people talking softer.

I actually have to be careful with this guy because of his sensitivity. like not making any medium or loud noises around him. A blender would cause him to jump and practically climb a wall because of its noise level.

he actually wears earplugs at the library just to point out how sensitive.

We kind of get in this match, speak up, talk quieter. we are like water and oil when communicating to one another lol

[RoseRodent]

I didn't manage to read all the pages so I'm not sure if this came up already, but sometimes this can be cultural too. I will avoid travel in Thailand where I have heard it is polite for a lady to speak quietly and also to cover her mouth. That's a double whammy to a deaf/hoh person. It is as alien to that person to ask them to speak loudly as it is to ask most of us to walk naked down the street - it's going to make them very uncomfortable.

Some people who have particularly good bone conduction may also perceive of their voices as much louder than they are, because when they speak it really ricochets around their heads, they assume their voices sound as loud to us as it sounds to themselves.

Not sure of a solution, though! I have a friend who is constantly trying to get her young son's attention when he's doing something inappropriate by saying his name under her breath from 20 feet away, getting increasingly agitated that he's not responding and gritting her teeth ever more solidly so her voice in fact gets *quieter* - she then says how awful it is that she has to "tell him 20 times" - probably because he can't hear the first 19 and he only heard the 20th because you went and stood next to him to tell him. Can't really chime in on it with my giant hearing aids and all, but I'd love to say to her that no living human could possibly be expected to know what she is saying.

I've got myself into trouble the other way around, that people tell me off for being "aggressive" if I'm loud. Can't they tell the difference? Aggressive is about what you say, too. You can threaten someone really quietly, or you can shout "My name is Rose" - clearly not an aggressive statement.

And it was a real problem when I worked in a shop that had all sorts of embarassing things behind the counter. When people came in with low voices I tended to hand them condoms, which was fun when people just had low voices!

[Lau2046]

This happens all the time for me - especially someone calling from another room - namely the x ray tech. Why do people call from another room? Can't they come and get you? Is it really that much trouble? You'd think people in the medical profession would know better. I hear you about the people that just don't know what "speak up please" means. It borders on rude but fortunately it hasn't been a huge issue for me after I tell them I really can't hear.


Laura

[Gramps]

When I went to school back in the Stone Age, pupils were taught public speaking as part of the curriculum. We were taught the proper way to enunciate words so they would come out more clearly and also to produce the voice from lower down in the gut rather than up in the sinus cavities and back of the throat (which is how young people speak today.)

As an offshoot, children were more likely to speak up, speak slowly and clearly and not mumble or swallow their words. It was also a really great way to gain some much needed self-confidence that was and is often missing in those early years.

I sure wish they would reinstate this in the curriculum today!

And for Pete's sake, give the people in the Media tutorials on speaking properly!

[seb]

Gramps,
Schools across North America are only interested in their pupils passing the standardized tests that the States or Provinces have said they must pass to graduate or advance to the next grade. Gone are the days when schools actually worked where they tracked kids by their ability: if they tested with academic abilities they went academic, if they tested business, they went business and if they tested industrial they went industrial. Today, they think that every kid is a rocket scientist and have them all take academic tracks and then they wonder why only 50% of all freshmen entering high school don't graduate or drop out, at least that is what it is in California. I don't think public speaking has been a requirement in CA since the early 60's.