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Thread: Is it possible to re-learn word recognition / speech discrimination?

  1. #1

    Default Is it possible to re-learn word recognition / speech discrimination?

    Hi all,


    I am wondering if it is possible to practice word recognition and if doing so would help in the real world at all?

    Iíve had significant hearing loss since I was born and am now 51. A recent speech recognition score was significantly lower than it was four years ago. The dispenser said my brain is forgetting how to process words (she used nicer language than that) which impacts how much assistance I can receive from hearing aids. I live on hearing aids and it distresses me that they may not be much help, say when I hit 60.

    Can I ever train my brain to discriminate land from lamb, pry from pie, some from sun, etc?? I thought that perhaps five or ten minutes a day, listening to random words from my computer might jumpstart some brain cells that are apparently not getting much practice. Is there such a program out there?

    Thank you!

    HAs: Resound Forzas, replacing before the end of the year (probably with Phonak B-R).

    Hz 250 500 750 1k 2k 3k 4k 5k 8k
    L 60 55 65 75 90 80 80 70 65
    R 65 65 65 70 80 75 75 65 60

    Speech
    L SRT: 70dB WRS: 76% / 95 dB
    R SRT: 75dB WRS: 52% / 95 dB

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TXGal View Post
    Hi all,


    I am wondering if it is possible to practice word recognition and if doing so would help in the real world at all?

    Iíve had significant hearing loss since I was born and am now 51. A recent speech recognition score was significantly lower than it was four years ago. The dispenser said my brain is forgetting how to process words (she used nicer language than that) which impacts how much assistance I can receive from hearing aids. I live on hearing aids and it distresses me that they may not be much help, say when I hit 60.

    Can I ever train my brain to discriminate land from lamb, pry from pie, some from sun, etc?? I thought that perhaps five or ten minutes a day, listening to random words from my computer might jumpstart some brain cells that are apparently not getting much practice. Is there such a program out there?

    Thank you!

    HAs: Resound Forzas, replacing before the end of the year (probably with Phonak B-R).

    Hz 250 500 750 1k 2k 3k 4k 5k 8k
    L 60 55 65 75 90 80 80 70 65
    R 65 65 65 70 80 75 75 65 60

    Speech
    L SRT: 70dB WRS: 76% / 95 dB
    R SRT: 75dB WRS: 52% / 95 dB
    There has been a study in Japan about using transcranial direct stimulation over the auditory complex and they were able to show improvement in a subject's speech discrimination https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26920927 I don't believe that this has ever been done outside of Japan and the study only involved one patient so take it for what it is.

    here is an online program called LACE training which is supposed to help you better discriminate speech in noisy settings. I am currently doing the LACE training. It costs $75 for 11 online sessions and seems good.
    I'm trying to learn speechreading to supplement my hearing. I found that lipreading.org is a pretty good site and you can get most of the lessons for free.
    Tony
    ---------------------
    Oticon OPNs
    Previously: Bernafon Juna 9s with Soundgate 3
    ----------------------
    55 55 50 10 60 25
    250 500 1000 2000 4000 8000
    55 60 45 15 20 10

    Word Recognition, 60% at 70 db (left), 96% at 65db (right)
    <Tested 1/2/17>

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Northern CA
    Posts
    3,484

    Default

    The LACE program will help in word recognition.
    Oticon Agil Pro w/streamer

    -250 500 1000 1500 2000 3000 4000 6000 8000
    L 10--5----10----30---50----70----85---80---80
    R 5--10----20----35---45----85----85--100--100

    SP Disc ------------- SRT
    L 88% @55db ------- L-10
    R 90% @55db------- R-25

  4. Default

    There was a published study earlier this year that found LACE training did not improve outcome measures:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26901263

  5. #5

    Default

    Some real life benefit may be obtained from learning lip reading techniques and how to use context in the sentence to help follow conversation or work out a word.
    Carol

    Linx 961>Linx2 961> Phonak Audeo V90 312T L&R
    Hz 250 500 1K 2K 3K 4K 5K 6K 8K
    L 25 25 15 35 40 40 60 60 55
    R 25 25 15 30 40 35 35 55 50
    Speech
    L 83% 40dB, 100% 50dB
    R 80% 40dB, 97% 50dB

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Psocoptera View Post
    Some real life benefit may be obtained from learning lip reading techniques and how to use context in the sentence to help follow conversation or work out a word.
    I don't read lips much but for sure I use context in the sentence to help me figure out words. Before I was fitted in the earlier day, I had to do this even more when I started having hearing loss but didn't wear any HAs yet.
    HA wearer since the 1990's > Rexton Insite+ CIC (2011-2016) > Oticon OPN RITE (2016)

    KHz 0.25...0.5...0.75...1.0...1.5...2.0...3.0...4.0... 6.0...8.0

    Left ...10...10....10.....30.....70....75....80....95.. ..90....80
    Right .25...30....40.....55.....75....85....90....90...1 00...100

  7. Default

    That tDSC study is pretty weak. They don't report the specifics of the word discrimination scores, and even with 50-word lists the test re-test deviation in word discrimination is VERY high. For example, say you do a 25-word list from the NU6 words and get 70% at one appointment, and then you get 50% at your next appointment. This is not actually a significant difference--it could just as easily have gone the other way and it doesn't mean anything. To be frank, a lot of audiologists don't know this (and my bet would be that almost NO hearing instrument specialists know this) and put more stock into the word recognition scores than is really warranted. Drops are more significant at the ends of the score; that is, a drop from 100% to 88% is significant, or a drop from 36% to 0% is significant, but a drop from 52% to 28% is not. To get a really good measure, you'd have to do hundreds of words. On the up-side, this may mean that you have actually NOT suffered a significant drop in your WRS scores and you were just having a bad day.

    In any case, with your level of hearing loss I do think it would be worthwhile looking into a Roger Pen system if that is something that might be available to you. It also never hurts to work on alternative strategies--environmental modification, speech reading, self-advocacy, conversation repair strategies, etc.

  8. #8

    Default

    I agree with you that changes in WRS can be simply an off day etc. When I initially lost my hearing due to encephalitis, my left ear scored 52% and my right ear scored 96% at my audiologist. I had two additional tests done at Costco. My right ear remained the same but my left ear showed 88% and then 92%. All tests were done using recorded speech at 65db. My hearing loss is due to damage to the nerve connections in the brain stem so my left ear has better tone scores, but my right ear is my real better ear as that is the ear I would use to understand on the phone etc.

    Anyway, I agree that technology coupled with speech reading and self advocacy are the only real ways to "regain" lost communication.
    Tony
    ---------------------
    Oticon OPNs
    Previously: Bernafon Juna 9s with Soundgate 3
    ----------------------
    55 55 50 10 60 25
    250 500 1000 2000 4000 8000
    55 60 45 15 20 10

    Word Recognition, 60% at 70 db (left), 96% at 65db (right)
    <Tested 1/2/17>

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Wales, UK
    Posts
    3,406

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Neville View Post
    That tDSC study is pretty weak. They don't report the specifics of the word discrimination scores, and even with 50-word lists the test re-test deviation in word discrimination is VERY high. For example, say you do a 25-word list from the NU6 words and get 70% at one appointment, and then you get 50% at your next appointment. This is not actually a significant difference--it could just as easily have gone the other way and it doesn't mean anything. To be frank, a lot of audiologists don't know this (and my bet would be that almost NO hearing instrument specialists know this) and put more stock into the word recognition scores than is really warranted. Drops are more significant at the ends of the score; that is, a drop from 100% to 88% is significant, or a drop from 36% to 0% is significant, but a drop from 52% to 28% is not. To get a really good measure, you'd have to do hundreds of words. On the up-side, this may mean that you have actually NOT suffered a significant drop in your WRS scores and you were just having a bad day.

    In any case, with your level of hearing loss I do think it would be worthwhile looking into a Roger Pen system if that is something that might be available to you. It also never hurts to work on alternative strategies--environmental modification, speech reading, self-advocacy, conversation repair strategies, etc.
    Yep, never had much faith in WRS as there's too much environmental instability in the tests even before you consider the actual statistical weakness.

    Even the claimed side by side tests for different fittings within the same environment aren't the best, which is why there is always a leap of faith with new hearing systems. Add to that 12-18 week habituation and you're struggling even more to find which aids 'sound better' vs the ones that 'work better'.
    'He who is not courageous enough to take risks will accomplish nothing in life.'
    Link to my entry in the Hidden Content section.
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  10. Default

    How can you even lose wrs? Is it just severe+ hearing loss or delaying wearing HAs?
    125 250 500 1000 2000 3000 4000 6000 8000
    L 5 5 20 25 40 45 50 45 50
    R 5 10 25 45 55 65 65 60 65

    Oticon OPN master race
    Sorry for my english

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